Joyce Meyer - Why Mentorship Matters - Part 1

Ginger Stache: Welcome to, «Enjoying Everyday Life». We have so much to learn from one another, and you have a lot to teach others. So today, we’re talking about enriching your life through mentorship. It’s an important concept. You’ve probably heard of its importance in business relationships, but it’s actually a biblical concept. It’s a topic that is important to Joyce, as well as, our guest today, the incomparable, Cece Winans. So, get cozy and join me, Erin Cluley, Joyce, and Cece on the pink couch to talk it out.

Ginger Stache: Hi, everyone. It is time to talk it out. We are so glad that you are here with us. We have a spot for you on the pink couch, right beside Erin and Cece Winans, today.

Erin Cluley: Right there.

Cece Winans: Right here.

Erin Cluley: I would like to take that one. I’ll scoot over.

Joyce Meyer: I was thinking about coming over there myself.

Erin Cluley: Right here, Joyce.

Ginger Stache: We can all just sit on the couch. Be really cozy. Cece, I love you so much. And I think that there’s just so many people who appreciate your talent and appreciate all that you’ve been to the music industry and the Kingdom of God for so long. But I have a funny story to tell you. So, my name is Ginger, of course. And so, a lot of people will tell me, «I had a dog named Ginger». Or, «I had a horse named Ginger». I get those stories all the time, continually. And I think it’s very sweet of them because I love animals. So, I’m like, «Oh, that’s so nice». I had a cat named Cece.

Cece Winans: You did?

Ginger Stache: Yes.

Joyce Meyer: Nobody has ever told me they had a dog named Joyce.

Ginger Stache: Just another one of those reasons that, you know, we’ve got something in common.

Erin Cluley: It’s good you prefaced that. She knows it’s endearing that you said that to her.

Ginger Stache: Absolutely.

Cece Winans: She set it up good. She did, set it up good.

Ginger Stache: I mean, after you get so many people saying, «I had a dog named Ginger,» you start to question your parents' choices in naming you.

Cece Winans: That’s right.

Ginger Stache: But that’s all right. Today, we’re going to talk about something that I really think will benefit a lot of people and it’s probably not talked about enough. And that is the importance of how much we need to lift one another up, support one another, especially as women across generational lines. I found that so much how my life has been blessed by women who have spoken into my life, and how I love being able to do that for other women that God brings into my life. So, we wanna talk about it in a way that I think a lot of people will appreciate because it will tell you how it will apply to you. This isn’t something mentors…Having a mentor, being a mentor is not something that is just for certain people, someone in business, or whatever it may be. We all need women to help one another. It’s very scriptural. It’s very much in the word. And as we talk about this, Cece, I know that God’s been talking to you, you’ve said, about the generations…

Cece Winans: Yes.

Ginger Stache: And what we need to be doing right now.

Cece Winans: Yes, for sure. You know, I’ve been singing for a long time in the public, over 40 years now. But my first solo, I was, you know, eight-years-old. And when I started recording, when I went to ptl club, I started recording with my brother. I was probably about 17, 18-years-old. And so, you know, you’re out here and you’re just doing what you’re doing day by day. And you look back and it’s like, okay, I don’t know when it happened, but I became part of the older generation. You know, it’s like, I was 17, it’s like, «Oh, okay». And it really did hit me, a few years back, really hard. I’ve always appreciated those who went before me because that’s why I’m still strong today. But understanding, like you said, we are all called to be pouring into somebody, to be a blessing to somebody. We need help, you know. So, it hit me that, you know, «Cece, you’re the mother of the church now». And it’s just like, «How did that happen»? You know, mothers who taught us the Word of God, having my own mother who lived right in front of me. I never had to wonder what holiness looked like, what a good wife and a mom was supposed to be, seeing her pray. And a lot of times it’s just watching her more so than what she said. I got so much out of it. It was a wealth of wisdom there, a wealth of peace, you know. I seen her go through rough situations. I mean, let’s think about it. My parents had 10 kids.

Joyce Meyer: Oh my gosh.

Cece Winans: Yeah. And they got married as teenagers and both of them came from broken homes, but they decided they were gonna live for Jesus and that they were gonna stay together. Had seven boys straight. I was the first girl, two younger girls after me. And so, just seeing how she lived her life through ups and downs and marriages with the children, the kids, it was just a blessing. And then, you know, the Holy Spirit just said, «Okay, now, who are you pouring into? How are you gonna make a difference in people’s lives the way those who went before you made in yours»? You know. And of course, I have one daughter, but he was like, «It’s not just about your household. It’s about people».

Ginger Stache: Yeah.

Cece Winans: It’s about women. It’s about, and so many people nowadays, especially young people who they don’t even know who their parents are.

Joyce Meyer: Right. Like, you talk about your childhood and mine was the exact opposite. I can never remember my parents ever actually sitting down with me and trying to teach me something. Never. Not one time. And I just had terrible role models and terrible examples. But God, he always gives you what you need, if you turn to him. Turn away from the bitterness and the resentment and the, «I’m mad at you and I hate you». And, no matter how, and I feel like there’s somebody listening that needs to hear this, no matter what somebody else has done to you, if you start making choices according to the Word of God, you can turn your life around and it can be absolutely wonderful.

Ginger Stache: I think it’s so beautiful too, the way that God has used your background to help so many other women. So, while you didn’t have that role model in your life, he’s made you mama Joyce to millions.

Cece Winans: Oh my God. Isn’t that amazing?

Ginger Stache: Yeah, it is.

Cece Winans: Mama Joyce to millions.

Joyce Meyer: Mama j.

Ginger Stache: Yeah.

Erin Cluley: Beautiful.

Ginger Stache: So, all of us have something that if we’re willing to give into other people’s lives that God will use. Whether we had a great beginning, it doesn’t matter, we can have a good end, like you say, all the time, and we can help other people too, as well.

Joyce Meyer: And everybody needs to realize today that whether you’re trying to be or not, you are some kind of an example to the people around you. It’s not just people in ministry that mentor others, you know, young mothers need to be mentored. And you know, that doesn’t necessarily mean you have a weekly appointment to sit down and do a teaching session. I think like you said, people learn from watching other people. They learn, like, my husband has always been so stable in his moods and such a peaceful man. And I grew up, I mean, war was the normal atmosphere that I grew up in. And I didn’t even really know what peace was like. And I saw Dave be so peaceful. He never sat down and taught me, but as I watched his life, he made me hungry for what I had. I think if we can realize that somebody is always watching us and how important it is to live the way God tells you to live and you, man, can affect so many people just by being stable. Like you said about your mom, she went through rough times, but she was stable. You watched her pray.

Cece Winans: Consistently.

Joyce Meyer: You watched her walk in love and that had such a great effect on you. God always, I think, puts people around us, it’s important that we choose the right people to be around. Choose people that you wanna be like. Choose people that you respect. And even as far as who you listen to as teachers and things like that, you know, just find somebody that is not just saying something but is living the life and really listen to what they tell you and watch how they live.

Erin Cluley: I grew up in a great home with parents that I love, and respect and they taught me the word. But also, growing up in a youth group, I had two women who were, I would have been in high school, so they were probably in their early thirties, they had little kids, that came alongside me and a group of girls and mentored us. And so, I love this topic because those women changed my life, because I had great parents I could go to talk to, and they did want my sister and I to come to them. But they also trusted that we needed an outlet to talk to and ask questions with somebody who weren’t parents that I could say, «My parents are driving me crazy,» or, «This is what they want me to do. I don’t know if I wanna do this». And they gave me godly wisdom. And so, I think it’s so important to find women in the right way, like you’re saying, that will continue to push you back to Jesus but is an outside voice. I think it’s so important.

Cece Winans: Definitely. I so agree with that. I remember my mother saying a lot of times, should I say, that when she got to church with all of us, she was so depending on the community to help her out.

Erin Cluley: Yeah, I’ll bet.

Ginger Stache: Yeah.

Joyce Meyer: Sure.

Cece Winans: Yeah. And I think in my own life, I only have two kids. But God used people outside of us that really turned them around.

Erin Cluley: Yeah. Because they have different experiences.

Cece Winans: That’s right. Yeah. That’s right. So, we definitely, it takes a village.

Ginger Stache: It does. I can’t imagine with 10 kids, like you said, you know, we had two. We didn’t have any family around us when we had our children and when they were little. And so, really depending on others coming in, to help be that and other women to help be what I needed, also. There were so many older women who, you know, many of them have no idea the strong influence they had on my life. And some of 'em do. But it really is amazing when we pray for divine connections, when we pray for the people that God wants to bring into our lives to be examples, to help us in the practical, the physical things and the spiritual things. It’s such a wonderful gift.

Erin Cluley: It is.

Ginger Stache: And a lot of people watching, I think, are longing for that, but don’t know either how to find it or how to be it for someone else. So, we wanna talk through some of the practicalities of how to make this work.

Joyce Meyer: And you know, there’s two sides to this. Might as well get it out early. Not only do we need people that have gone before us and know more than we do, but we also can learn from people younger than us. So, it goes two ways.

Ginger Stache: Yeah.

Joyce Meyer: And, as you know, my baby son came to work here when he was in his 20's. And I don’t know that our ministry would be what it is today if I wouldn’t have listened to some of the things that he told me that I needed to change.

Ginger Stache: Well, we happen to have a clip ready just to share that very thing that you’re talking about.

Erin Cluley: Nice transition, Joyce.

Ginger Stache: How’s that? Good job.

Joyce Meyer: Wasn’t that cool?

Ginger Stache: Let’s see what Joyce has to say about the importance of learning from people who are younger than us and how the generations need one another.

Joyce Meyer: You know, every generation always gossips about the younger generation coming up under them. I remember some of the goofy things that we did when I was a teenager, I mean just silly things. Girls back then would wear a headscarf and tie it in a knot and put the knot up here on their chin. What’s with that? Makes no sense. And just, you know, all kinds of weird stuff, you know. And our parents thought we were crazy. And now, we look at the younger generation and we don’t get the hairstyles and the this and the that and the something else. Dave and I still sit over there sometimes, and listen, I love my worship teams, but I’m telling you what, and it’s not just these guys. I mean, we’ve got four or five different ones that travel with us, and we changed our style of worship, purposely, did it on purpose, at the direction of God to bring in young people. And I know some of you think the music is too loud and you think this and that and, you know, there’s a whole bunch of stuff that, I mean, I could go back to hymns and be happy the rest of my life, but that’s not what the younger generation needs. And if we don’t bring them in, we’re going to lose society, period. And I’ve had to learn that I’m not called to minister to myself. It doesn’t really matter if I like it, as long as it’s gonna get God’s job done. Amen? And you know what I’ve learned? God, believe it or not, actually anoints denim, not just polyester. I mean, I couldn’t believe it. I thought the only way you could be godly is if you wore a three-piece suit and, you know, full everything to church. And then I started noticing how anointed some of these young people are and what God’s doing through them and the praise and worship they’re bringing and how the spirit comes in. And so I’ve just come to the point, I don’t really care if they don’t dress like me. I don’t care if their hairstyle’s not like mine. You know what? You want to know the truth? When Moses came down off mount Sinai after 40 days and nights and he came down with those Ten Commandments, I bet none of us would have wanted to have coffee with him either. 'cause I bet there was, he was not looking all that great. And not only that, there’s not one of us that would have hung out with John the Baptist 'cause he looked like a wild man and ate locust and honey and lived out in the woods. «Repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand». You’re like, «I’m not hanging out with you, buddy». Come on. You only have one life, what are you gonna do with it? The choice is yours. Are you gonna keep it, give it for something useless, or give it to God? The Bible says that «Unless the seed falls in the ground and dies, it abides alone, but if it dies, it bears much fruit». You can have a very fruitful, satisfying, amazing life if you’ll just let God do the work in you that he wants to do, and not be the center of your own universe, and really sincerely ask God to use you.

Ginger Stache: So, one of the…

Cece Winans: Amen.

Ginger Stache: One of the things that is so beautiful in that is that we can ask God to use us, but if we’re not ready to listen, not a lot’s gonna happen. If you would have said, when your son, Dan, came to you and said, you know, «These are some ways that you could draw more people into Christ». If you would have said, «Nope, it’s got to be polyester and hymns, or it’s not gonna happen». But that’s not what you did. You had to be open.

Joyce Meyer: Well, I started looking at our crowds and they were all my age. And that’s dangerous when you see that happening. And what was happening was our crowds were starting to shrink and I didn’t understand why. My son said, «You don’t have any young people coming. They’re all your age». And he said, «You need to change some things. You need to stop wearing your st. John’s suits with all the rhinestones on 'em, you know, and wear some cooler clothes». And I said, «Well, I like my clothes». «And get the flowers off the platform and get some younger bands». I’m like, «Well, I like…I like…I like». And he said, «Oh, excuse me. I didn’t know you were called a minister to yourself». Oh, he’s the only person that could have got by with that.

Cece Winans: Sounds like your son.

Joyce Meyer: Because he’s my baby and he just can get by with stuff that nobody else can. And that was really the truth. We’re not called to minister to ourselves, but sometimes we do want everything the way we like it, and we’re not thinking about what might draw other people. And even like other people say, mature Christians who come to, say a conference of mine now, maybe they think the music is too loud or they don’t understand the way the worship leaders dress: got his hat on backwards and his hair going in 50 directions or whatever. But are they there just for them? Or do they really, you know, if we really had a revival, could we stand it? Or because the people that came in wouldn’t look like us.

Cece Winans: That’s right.

Joyce Meyer: They wouldn’t smell like us. They wouldn’t be like us.

Cece Winans: That’s right. Do we really want it?

Joyce Meyer: We need to get out of our own head and stop thinking that «I want everything and every church service to be what’s comfortable for me». And let’s do more toward building the Kingdom of God.

Cece Winans: Totally agree.

Erin Cluley: I love what you’re saying because there are revivals taking place now on college campuses. And so, across the country you see that, and it is exciting to me to think, «Wow, those people then can turn and learn from women who have gone before them. And that’s great. They found Jesus. Now they need to know what to do next and what’s the next step to take». But if we are not ready with open arms to embrace something that looks different than who we are, we’re gonna miss a group of people who are hungry and ready to know Jesus.

Joyce Meyer: We’re living in a time that the Bible prophesied would happen where dark would become darker and light would become lighter. And there’s some really bad things taking place on some of our college campuses. But at the same time, we’re having revival on those same college campuses in different areas.

Erin Cluley: Right.

Joyce Meyer: And you see that so plainly in the way people behave today. It’s like some people behave just so awful. But then there’s a lot of really godly people that are really wanting to mature and grow up. And we need to be concerned about the younger generation.

Cece Winans: Amen.

Joyce Meyer: Because they are in deep trouble if they don’t have some heroes and some people that they can look up to and say, they know what’s right and what’s wrong. They know if they see somebody that they would like to follow or somebody they don’t want anything to do with. And I pray a lot for our young people that God will give them heroes, people that they can really admire and look up to and say, «I wanna be like that».

Cece Winans: I think God is doing great things in the younger generation. Great things. Like Joyce was saying in the teaching, so many times, we hear the negative and we’re so ready to talk down at them that we miss what he’s doing. So, many experiences in this. First, when you were talking about your son, you know, a few albums back, my son produced the record, the whole record for me. And oh, man, every time he pushed that button, it was like, «Mom, do it again». And I’m like, «Do it again? Boy, I was singing before you were thought of. What are you talking about, do it again»?

Joyce Meyer: I love it. «Mom, that was a little off». I was just like, «Uh…Oh my God». I can just imagine.

Cece Winans: But I’m so glad I listened to him.

Joyce Meyer: So hard, so hard.

Cece Winans: It was rough. But I saw the anointing. I saw the ears that he had that I no longer had and also being relevant. You know, but he never wanted to dishonor the principles.

Joyce Meyer: Right.

Cece Winans: You know, even when we started our church 12 years ago, the Lord told my husband, that my son would pastor. And I remember the Holy Spirit saying, «Cece, it’s gonna look different. It’s gonna, so just be still, be quiet and watch me do a new thing». Because mama Joyce, don’t you think if we don’t embrace the generation, we get stuck?

Joyce Meyer: Oh yeah, we do. All we know is what we know. But God’s always teaching people other things. And you know, I can change my clothes, I can’t change my morals. And that’s the thing that I think they will respect us for if we’re willing to meet them where they’re at, but not come into agreement with a sinful lifestyle.

Cece Winans: There you go. And you know what? I’m finding that they just want the real thing. We just have to be willing to give up those things that really don’t even matter.

Joyce Meyer: Right, and some of us have become pretty phony.

Ginger Stache: Yeah, that’s a good way to say it. It is giving up some of those things that are very superficial. They feel hugely important to us, often. But it’s giving up the superficial things without compromising.

Cece Winans: Without compromising.

Ginger Stache: Right, and that’s the truth.

Cece Winans: And that’s the thing. They wanted holiness. They were hungry for holiness. They came from different walks of life. And they didn’t, like she said, they respect us more for living the standard, but not being willing to, I don’t know, be phony and superficial. That’s what they don’t want. They don’t want the part that God doesn’t want.

Ginger Stache: That’s true. That’s really important.

Cece Winans: That’s what I’m finding out. They really want what matters. And that’s really what God has always been interested in, is the heart, what matters, not what we dress it up with.

Ginger Stache: Haven’t you always felt like when someone tries really hard to be cool that nobody thinks they’re cool anyway, right?

Erin Cluley: Yes.

Ginger Stache: But God has a way of bringing people together and molding and shaping us where we need to in a way so that people do become attracted to what he’s put inside of us.

Cece Winans: That’s good.